Overcoming mental health challenges

**Suicide discussion warning**

In this episode of The Kindling Project, Amy and Melissa have the pleasure of talking to Kaitlyn Young. Kaitlyn is honest, vulnerable, and raw with us as she describes the barriers and limitations she has overcome in her young life. We cover everything from unmasking ourselves, what it means to be relentless, Borderline Personality Disorder, self-harm, and religion while finding your true calling. From someone who didn’t see a life worth living to now owning two businesses, Kaitlyn learned how to overcome her most complicated challenges and find her purpose to help others unmask themselves. Be prepared to fall in love with her courage and her story about the llama that genuinely saved her life. 

How did you overcome your mental health struggles?

“I was completely checked out. Like as soon as I turned 18, I was paying for my own bills. So that way, when I did check out, my parents wouldn't have to worry about anything.”

From someone who didn’t see a life worth living to now owning two businesses, Kaitlyn learned how to overcome her most complicated challenges and find her purpose to help others unmask themselves.

“I knew my mission was to help others unmask their greatness and help them step into their raw and real selves and own it, that they can be who they were called to be, even though it's not the mold of the normal business person, mold of the normal person and step into that and still have a successful whole life.”

Be prepared to fall in love with her courage and her story about the llama that genuinely saved her life.

Kaitlyn Young is a published best-selling author and owner of Social Media Doctor LLC and Raw and Real Empowerment LLC.

Learn more about The Kindling Project at our website: https://www.thekindlingproject.com/ and join our Facebook group for women looking for that extra kindling to start their subsequent big fire! The Kindling Project - Ignite. The Kindling Project is sponsored by Memora, an experience design agency that creates memorable brand experiences. Memora is offering our listeners a FREE 30-minute brand consultation. Schedule yours now.

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• Transcript

  Melissa: Welcome to the Kindling podcast. Today's guest is Kaitlyn young. She has a best selling book on Amazon, unmasking the greatness within, where she tells her story about overcoming mental health barriers and going from being a Walmart employee to being a business owner in less than a year and how a Llama saved her life. So we're gonna have a great conversation with Kaitlyn today. Welcome. Hi ladies.

  Amy: Hi Kaitlyn. Hi Melissa. I'm so glad to have Kaitlyn here. I can't wait to get to know you.

  Melissa: I know she's an inspiration.

  Kaitlyn: Thank you for having me on I'm so glad to be here.

  Amy: Thank you. Kaitlyn and Melissa, thanks so much for that introduction.

  Kaitlyn, Melissa and I are excited to have you on our podcast today because when we think about the kindling project and we think about having that fire within and what really motivates us, what drives that flame, what fans, it, you really stuck out in our mind because you're younger than us.

  Do you mind letting us know or telling us how old you are?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah, I'm 26 years old. I yeah, just turned 26, March 14th.

  Amy: Okay, so you are a March baby, and so you're definitely younger than Melissa and I just a few years and by half what I think what really inspired us is that you- your kindling project, which we looked at as your book and now being a business owner really you got to this kindling project, not just walking in the doors and saying, it's here and I'm gonna start and we're good to go. You really had to overcome some real challenges, mental health challenges, and I'm sure other challenges as well to get to where you are and to do this at a younger age really is inspiring.

  And so that's what we really wanna know about. We wanna know some things about you. We wanna know how you- where you really started and where you where it took you. And the great thing is you have so many wonderful things to look forward to, and you really have put yourself on this path of enlightenment in a lot of ways. And we're excited for you. We really wanna support you with that. Why don't you tell us a little bit about when we think about a kindling project, when we think about that fire inside, was it writing a book or what was it for you?

  Kaitlyn: So for me, to start a little bit earlier than that to give you the backstory of how it started,

  I struggle- I have something called borderline personality disorder, and so I did not know that till I was older, it was triggered when I was six. When I basically thought my parents didn't love me. Because of the situation growing up and so I didn't have any kind of flame or anything like that until I was 22.

  I actually planned on ending my life since I was 16. I planned on, basically being done with life. I was completely checked out. Like as soon as I turned 18, I was paying for my own bills. So that way, when I did check out, my parents wouldn't have to worry about anything. And when I was 22 after marrying my husband, I had made a decision to end my life, sent all the letters to people saying goodbye and, At that point- and it wasn't until I was in a mental Institute for six weeks on and off that I had that kindling. So what happened was I realized after a bit of faking it, to get out of there and then getting put back in that was putting myself back in and I didn't realize why. Because I wanted to be done. Why was I putting myself back into this place? And it dawned on me that it's because I had a purpose that was unfulfilled. I'm a kind of a religious person. So I felt that this, if I was not supposed to be here, God would've taken me home already. So this was an affirmation to myself that my mission's not over.

  So that kind of threw me onto this flame of okay, I need to find my purpose in life. And so I took a year to get my mental health together because it was just messed up, figuring out I had BPD and really just going down this path working at Walmart and all that and trying to find my purpose. It wasn't till last year when I started in an insurance agency, that I realized that I could do a little bit more. That really ignited the flame, and I knew that my story was meant to be shared to help others get through those hard times, because the thing is that, there's so many people out there that mask themselves. There's so many people that pretend they're fine. There's so many people that will just basically coast through life and then all of a sudden disappear and no one knows why. So I'm, as I went through and I had mentors like Chris Whitehead that really just, took me by the hand and showed me the way. I realized quickly my purpose in life is to help others unmask their hidden truths within, and that inspired me to write my book. And so that's where the whole book came from in the kindling. I did the book actually in a weekend. Basically did it on Otter AI spoke it into existence and here we are.

  Melissa: I'm so proud of you. That is such a big overcoming barriers kind of story. And I just wanna ask how does the Llama fit in?

  Kaitlyn: For sure. So I was homeschooled, so I didn't have a lot of friends that lived nearby. I had friends, but they were an hour and a half, two hours away. Like not a lot of close friends. And my neighbor had Llamas and when I was 10, I would go up and pet this Llama

  and we had this soul bond. Now from the time I was six till when I was 22, I would not tell my parents any issues I had. I would not tell, anyone, any problems I had because the thing is I honestly believed in the back of my mind that I was the lowest sibling on the six sibling totem pole, all because I had stayed at my cousin's house and I got bit in the eye by the dog and they told me my parents didn't wanna talk to me at six. And at six you think, oh my gosh, my parents don't love me, impressionable mind, and that's what threw my mind off for the first of my life basically. But the Llama comes in because I was able to tell the Llama everything, because the Llama couldn't talk back and there was times when I'm like I'm done with life I'm, whatever. And I was just going to, end it and I would go up there and she would lay her head on my shoulder and hum softly and calm me down. She had such a way of knowing who I was and knowing my emotions.

  We had such a bond, that she knew exactly why I needed when I needed it. And she could relate to me because she also had a rough past, she was born deformed. And she had to be straightened out on a table with her legs and she was scared of people because of that, except me.

  Amy: That's so beautiful. You just unpacked so much right there. Thank you so much for sharing and being so vulnerable with Melissa and I, because what you just shared there's a lot there, there is a lot what you just shared and the Llama, what was the Llama's name?

  Kaitlyn: Madori.

  Melissa: Madori? It's such a Testament to the animal human bond that's possible.

  Amy: Yes.

  You had free animal therapy every time you went to be by Madori. I wanna back up for a moment because I wanna help. I wanna understand cause if, if you know me and Melissa knows, I like to really know everything. I like to know the, how things get to how they get to really. you got bit by a dog in the eye. Okay. You were six at the time, who told you that they don't love you? What, tell me, help me understand what that meant.

  Kaitlyn: So the thing that happened was I wanted to call my mom cause my mom was not there. It was with my- I was staying at a cousin's house and they said my mom wasn't available.

  She didn't have time for me, is the answer they gave me. But in reality, my mom had no idea what was going on.

  Amy: Okay.

  Kaitlyn: As a six year old, I didn't know that. I, you believe the adult, you believe what they say. And so I took it as, wow. My mom doesn't have time for me. And, she knows I'm injured, but she doesn't care, and I'm one of six, so I figured, oh, because I'm the lowest sibling, right? So the rest of my life till I was like 22, I spent my time trying to prove that I was a good kid. Like I spent my time hiding anything that ever bothered me and basically just masking it and taking on if my parents got into a fight, I'd be the one to remove my other siblings from the room and, tell them stories and stuff like that. I would make up stories about myself to get attention from them. And I'd also make up stories to make them think I was fine because, I was no problem Kaitlyn. I was just the perfect kid. So that way they didn't have to worry about me because I figured they didn't wanna worry about me anyway and I just figured it'd be easier if I was that in their mind.

  Melissa: Oh, that's an enormous amount of pressure that you put on yourself at such a young age, but I can honestly tell you, I do actually relate to that sort of very early hypersensitivity to things people say, and even at 50, things people said to me at third grade will pop into my mind and I will realize I am still acting under a premise that's not true and is so old. Like why is it hanging on? And we can't be the only ones. This has to be-

  Amy: you're not, I can tell you that as a therapist.

  Melissa: Maybe it happens more to sensitive people. Maybe it happens more to women or maybe it happens equally to all of us, but I really can relate to how one turn of phrase or one misunderstanding can have a whole trajectory in one's life.

  Amy: Yeah. And and you're so right on that, Melissa. Especially when you are- then, it's not just the sensitivity though. It's the- there's not those reinforcement around you in the environment that no, you know what mom was, I wasn't home and I wasn't available, but I'm here now and you're safe and I've got you, and I'm not saying that was the case with you, but I do know that it's one thing to be sensitive, but it's another not to have that emotional safety net to be able to fall when you are a sensitive person, to someone to like basically check you at the door and say, no, it's actually, okay, I've got you, you've got yourself kind of thing. On that Kaitlyn?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah, exactly. With my parents the thing was, my mom didn't wanna upset me more than she did, like more than I was. And so she thought, bless her heart that by not getting upset about it and like making it sounded like she hates my other family and stuff that she was, being more caring behind the doors she was pissed and like calling people and like all that, I found out later, but she was trying to keep everything calm, but in my impressionable mind, I was like, wow. There's not even, it's not even a big deal, so it just reinforced, like you said, that thought of, wow, I, I guess this is true, and so from that moment on that's how I saw it, and yeah it definitely is crazy how something that little can trigger.

  Melissa: Getting bit in the face. When I was little, I was bit in the face by a dog, not in the eye, but along the side of my cheek. And it is a big trauma being attacked by an animal.

  Amy: Yes. Yeah, definitely. So Kaitlyn, you said, it sounds like the ideology is, as we say in the clinician world "of suicide" was, is a part of your story.

  Kaitlyn: Oh, definitely. I, it was more than an idea for me. I tried to act on it three times. I also self-harmed for three, four years I was a cutter. And then I also binge ate heavily. And so I just was self sabotaging myself to make myself look as ugly as I felt on the inside on the outside. And what the one time I remember I was 16 and I was in my parents' bathroom about to swallow a bottle of Tylenol and my little sister who is, only seven, eight at the time walks in and she doesn't even remember this, but she walks in to grab something and that's the only thing that stopped me is that he walked into that room. Another time, I basically was going to just, run away and then, hang myself. But what stopped me then was the Llama , and just embracing me. And then the last time was, I literally had said goodbye to my family. We went and saw Avengers end game. My mom knew something was wrong. She kept asking what's wrong? What's wrong? I was so good at hiding the truth that, I just was like, oh, I'm having an off day, whatever. And I literally had everything planned out letters were wrote. The next day my husband was going to work, I was going to kiss him goodbye. I had the medication, I was gonna take sitting in the other room and I was going to lay on the bed with my cats and go. That was the plan. And what happened was, is I was in that phase of being ecstatic and excited to be done with it, and my husband noticed something was wrong. And so him noticing is what stopped because I ended up opening up to him. I'm so thankful for that man is the most caring, amazing person ever. And he's in tune with me. Thank God and he noticed I was off and he wouldn't leave me alone and he hugged me and that's when I broke.

  Amy: Wow. For the first time, was this the first time it all came out basically of your previous attempts and?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah. Like some of that came out to my parents a little bit because they noticed cuts and stuff like that.

  Amy: Okay.

  Kaitlyn: But I never told the full truth, I was so good at lying to myself and to others that I didn't know the full truth anymore. There are parts in my life where I still look back. I'm like, okay, what actually happened? Because I got so good at line. And it was my mechanism to shut it off. And so when that happened, that's when I started, he got me into the pine rest and institution and stuff, and we just started this process and that's where I got the diagnosis of borderline.

  Amy: Gosh, that must have been such a relief to be like, okay, wow, this isn't just because of X, Y, and Z, but there's actually a reason now that I can understand how my brain is wired and why I think these things and why I think this way.

  Kaitlyn: Yep, exactly.

  Amy: Wow. Kaitlyn, you're really inspiring us because mental health, mental wellness, mental checks, you remind me of a person who does die by suicide, where families say everything was always okay, they just paid their bills, they just went to work. They just closed the- and nothing was ever wrong. Quote unquote and it really leaves families in such despair, such desperation, because you said you, what did you say easygoing Kaitlyn, or you were nothing was ever wrong, right?

  Kaitlyn: Yep. Exactly. I was the, not only was, I tried to make everything good in my world, but I tried to make things good in my family's world. So I was the peacekeeper. Like my parents are a lot better now about it, but at the time they, they fought a lot. And my dad had some anger issues and I would be the one to get in between them and stop them from fighting at 12 years old, 14 years old. And, basically take the siblings downstairs, tell them stories and stuff to keep them entertained, and there's still some trauma with my siblings because they still don't know with me, like what was truthful and what was not. I was so good at lying to myself that I lied to them too. And so that's something I'm still working on is they don't trust me, even though I've done the work, I have to prove to them that, that's not who I am anymore. And that, integrity is a big thing for me now, but you do something for so long. It's hard to show that to someone.

  Melissa: Takes a lot of courage and a lot, just a tremendous amount of bravery to be this honest. And I have to say, I really admire it, and I think so many people spend their whole lives trying to get to this level of integrity. And here you are at 26, you're modeling it for all of us. I love that.

  Amy: Thank you. I know. That's how I feel too integrity is, and I just wanna say also Kaitlyn, that, you're talking about proving yourself to your parents, but I really want to encourage you to keep, if you keep proving yourself to yourself, everything will fall into place. Living amends is, is part of recovery. And I don't know anything about like with you if recovery is your story or it's not, but you talked about binge eating and there's definitely themes of cutting those are definitely themes of addiction and things like that. But you're, you are doing this by doing living amends is where I'm going with it. That if you keep showing up for yourself, everybody around you will continue to see that you are well and you are okay. And because when we're wanting to prove ourselves to other people, oftentimes we fall short because we think, oh they're thinking this, or they're thinking that, and we don't have any control over that. So I really wanna encourage you Kaitlyn to just keep living true to yourself and everything else will fall into place because you're the one that has to wake up in the morning with believing in yourself and knowing that you're okay in that moment.

  Kaitlyn: Exactly. And that's something I had to come to terms with, like I said, I have a little bit of religiousness in me and so I also believe for me my value comes from God first and then I hold onto it. And I found that to be a key is as long as I'm living the life that I know I'm supposed to be living and doing it in integrity, the rest will fall into place.

  Amy: Do you have hesitancy to say you are religious? cause you said I'm a little, I have some little religious and cause that's almost like I'm a little bit pregnant or I'm a little bit- because like when you're religious or you have a relationship with God or a lot, or a higher power it's not like a little bit or a tiny bit or a fraction tell us about that. Do you have some, what is, especially if you were homeschooled too, I'm thinking that was a part of it.

  Kaitlyn: Yes. So my parents are Catholic and they are wonderful people. My dads literally becoming a deacon awesome stuff. But I am on a road of re- accepting my faith, I would say I, I don't know exactly where I'm at in it. Life is a journey. I know, I believe in God. I know that, I'm definitely Christian stuff like that, but because religion was so pounded into us growing up, and it was almost a judgemental thing to judge people, you know that, oh, they had a baby out of wedlock oh, they're L G whoever, things like that, that, when I grew up and stuff, I'm like, wow. I felt like I was condemning people when in reality, we each all have sin. We each all have our things that we mess up and we are each individually loved by God in my mind. And so that's why I say that I don't wanna offend someone. I let them know, Hey, this is my belief, but I don't wanna offend people and push it on them. And that's why I always say a little bit, not that I am a little bit it's I don't want to push something or push my agenda on them cause I know what that looks like.

  Melissa: Yeah, when religion is used as a hammer or a judgment it's so off putting it, it really, I think does turn people away from faith. I wasn't personally raised with formal religion, and so I'm also like yourself on my own spiritual journey. I don't necessarily identify as a Christian or, as a Buddhist or a Hindu or any specific religion, but I would- I would also say to people, oh, I'm on a spiritual path or I'm figuring it out. And it's not necessarily a little bit or a lot. It's just loosely defined. I'm still getting to the point where it's really not even necessary for me to articulate how I define it. cause it's personal.

  Amy: It is. It is. And so Kaitlyn here's a little insider scoop of when you have a few more times are on the sun like your sister's over here do, is that it's not your responsibility, whether or not you offend people. Now, of course, if you're like a jerk to people, then of course you wanna be like, I'm sorry, but you are not responsible. If you're talking about your relationship with God or religion if you're being intentionally mean and cruel, that's different. But if it's just, you're sharing your truth and speaking with intention, then that's important. And that's what we wanna know. That's and that's how I feel. I feel like you're being very honest, very truthful. And so I just wanna encourage you to, again, this is about you, and I know I'm really like honing in on some of the therapeutic, mental health things in this conversation, but I really feel strongly to share that with you.

  Kaitlyn: No, I appreciate it. I know I'm on a journey still. And so any tips are always helpful.

  Melissa: I wanna know. I, this is such heavy, important stuff, but I also wanna know somewhere in this story of struggle and barriers and growing up, you did start to have that fire or have a little calling or awakening or message from God or the universe that you're here for something important, something bigger. And could you talk a little bit about how that came to you and then how you've- that's really our theme here. What was the kindling on that fire? How did you fan that fire who showed up for you? I'm very interested in that part of the story.

  Kaitlyn: So it really started last year, learned a lot. It was my first like experience and I was, in love with it at first and I, did everything possible to grow in it. And I met someone I met a lot of people that helped me along the way, but the overall theme was, I would jump in all head first, with the company and I'd give everything. And I would find out that we weren't aligned or, something like that. And I would end up, splitting ways with them. And I realized quickly, I didn't fit the mold of being an employee. I didn't fit the mold of, what people wanted because I gave more than I was asked. I was a giver. And so what happened was I had a conversation last November, very quick one with a guy named Chris Whitehead and I just- he radiated integrity. He radiated up most raw and real. And I had never had a conversation with someone like him that it was just real, there was no like barrier. He was just gonna be real with you. And I knew I needed to be in a conversation with him again. So I joined his thing he had going and there was an option to have a one on one conversation with one of the coaches and he was one of them. So I decided to go platinum for that reason, even though I could not afford it. Like I literally spent my last time. Plus some, I was like negative 500 in the bank to get that. And I was like, I'm going have a conversation with this dude. And his conversation. He said some things to me that were hard to swallow, but true. And that conversation kindled in me like that conversation literally made me think my story is my message. My mess is my message. And it started that okay, but how do I do that? I started going to more events going to all these things and I go to an event in February. With Stacy Radski and we are doing this breathing exercise and I've never really stayed still before. I've just gone, and I was forced to stay still in that moment. And in that moment, when we're staying still, I basically see raw and real within written in the sand in this vision, basically as I'm sitting there breathing and I'm like, holy cow, And that night I was up till 4:00 AM coming up with core values, coming up with all these things for this mission I had in my head, I knew my mission was to help others unmask their greatness and help them step into their raw and real selves and own it, that they can be who they were called to be, even though it's not the mold of the normal business person, mold of the normal person and step into that and still have a successful whole life.

  Melissa: I love that. I love that. My mess is my message. I love that idea. It's very relatable.

  Kaitlyn: Yeah. So that's how it started. I literally. The book was done like February 28th and it got published on my birthday, March 14th. And it was a bus seller within three hours.

  Melissa: That just goes to show you how many people can relate to struggle.

  Amy: Yeah, definitely. So that, so Kaitlyn, this was November of 21.

  Kaitlyn: Yep.

  Amy: And you got to know Chris Whitehead at that time, what was taught in there it's about being still about breathing, about connecting, connecting to yourself, connecting to your breath and goals and things like that. Not just goals, but there's a lot, but you also resonated with him. And I think that's something, it sounds like he was a mentor to you in a lot of ways. And that's really important to have a mentor, to have somebody that we can really connect with. Even if our lives, we come from very different walks of life. It's incredible how we can connect to someone on a cellular level that you would never put those two together in a room,

  Kaitlyn: yeah. That's exactly it like it, the breathing and all that was Stacy Radski, she does her own thing. She's awesome. But just her clarification. But chris yeah, it's funny cause he did the foreword for my book and he put in it, like he thought I was just like the pushover wanting to get to the top kind of person because that's usually my age group, we just do whatever. And we were polar opposites. We shouldn't have been like the kind of people that connected so easily. And it's funny now because. he, I call him grandpa and tease him all the time and, talks back to me. And it that's just how it is. Like we both, are still, connected like that. He's still my mentor and all that. And he's gonna be a speaker at my new event and all that. And it's just funny how those connections that you don't think are gonna happen with the people are least likely.

  Melissa: I met a lot of wonderful people and you're right. There's some really good messaging. In there, but I agree, Chris Whitehead of all the people and the coaches I met, he, he also resonated with me not to be giving him a, a plug today, but he is a business coach, but he is also like you said, a very transparent and real person. And it just you feel that energy when you sit next to him that there's just not a lot of bullshit here. And I really appreciated that. And I think that's, Finding a coach or a mentor or a therapist or a friend or somebody like that? Yes, it can just happen organically, but I think it's important to look at you sought it out and for anybody listening that needs to have that kind of coaching or that kind of messaging. Sometimes you have to spend your last dollar, or sometimes you have to get on a plane and travel from Michigan to Texas, but I would really encourage people to listen to the story that you're telling here. And one of 'em is, seeking, seek, seeking it out, finding the connections and finding the advice that you need or the counsel that you need because we're not doing this alone. None of us are doing this life alone. And for Amy and I, we're no Chris whiteheads in the business coaching space, but our mission with the kindling project is to provide a little bit of space or energy for people who are seeking each other or seeking affirmation or looking for resources. There's just not enough spaces. I think particularly for women, the community that you and I have been part of, and there's a bunch of 'em, they're very heavily male oriented in my experience. And that's great. And for a lot of women exposure to that masculine energy is useful because it's, " huh?" why aren't me and my girls doing this, why don't we have each other's backs like this? There's a lot of male energy positivity, but I do think creating female spaces that are the counterpart to that. I know that's something Amy and I are doing and I think that maybe that's something you're also thinking about, right?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah, exactly. I think that there's definitely a balance there. And like you said, there's not enough spaces like that. And like you said too, there's, a lot of times this woman are supposed to, make it in a man's world. We're supposed to, Basically pretend everything's fine. Not talk about mental illness, not talk about all the things that women have to deal with that men don't and, but still pretend that we are them, and that's just not how it is, and like with the mental illness part, I was terrified to tell people I had BPD and that I'm on medication for that. I literally fired a therapist for this because they told me BPD means you won't ever do anything better than Walmart. I had a therapist tell me that.

  Amy: Oh, and so that's awful.

  Kaitlyn: Yeah. And so you get to a point where you're like, as woman and mental health, whatever, you keep being told, oh, you can't do that cause you're not a man. Oh, you can't do that because of this, and I say bullshit , So the thing is that we are, if not more capable, and I think that, having a space like you guys do for the kindling project is so important, and I think having a space for empowerment is too

  Melissa: Right, and it's obviously, because we're all unique individuals, we're crafting a unique space. It's a reflection of Amy and I, but there's an infinite amount of kinds of spaces that are gonna appeal to women and we just need more of, 'em more of all kinds of them, whether they're about business or about creativity or about mental health, about friendship, about wealth. Money is a big topic, a taboo topic for women. We're not supposed to be dependent, but we're not supposed to make our own money. And then if we do make our own money, God forbid, we talk about how much money we made then we're bragging. And there's so many things like that, that you have so much time ahead of you and you have made such an enormous stride at such a young age. Like it's just, it's gonna be inspiring to watch the stages that you can build.

  Kaitlyn: Yeah, we have our first virtual stage coming up. I'm excited.

  Melissa: Tell us about what kind of content you wanna present. Like what you think it is that you you're here to share or teach?

  Kaitlyn: So me and two people I met came up with the company Raw and Real empowerment and our focus is going to be, you know, empowering the raw and real you, it's going to be, basically living in truth, being relentless integrity, being bold and empowered to be who you were called to be. And So that's what we're here to do. We're gonna create a coaching program, we're gonna do all that because the thing is that, like you said, there's different needs. You guys are concentrating on igniting that fire and that's such an important need. And for me With my mission being unmasking people, like I just wanna help people get to who they truly are. I want them to be okay with being vulnerable and not being judged for it, having that safe space that they can, say, I did all this, blah, blah, blah, and not be judged.

  Amy: Yeah. Yeah. That's so true. One of, one of the things that I've done for many years is I teach yoga and what I would always tell my students is that no one is gonna judge you more than yourself. And it's, so we, we think so often, oh, these people are judging me and these think, people think of this and that, but the reality is no one will be our own worst critic other than ourselves really, we really have to get out of our own way. And by the grace of God, you did get mental health care. And it sounds like you had a good diagnosis that really puts you on this path. Now this trajectory of of success. And the thing is Kaitlyn is, we really can't do much if we have such a barrier in front of us, because we, especially if we're dealing with trauma from decades ago, really. And so I really applaud you for hopefully you, you fired that therapist that told you that because, it's so interesting. And I tell Melissa this all the time, it's hard to find a good therapist. I Just like it is, it's hard to find. A good. What am I trying to say?

  Melissa: Anything, a yoga teacher, a graphic designer.

  Amy: Thank you.

  Melissa: A doctor, and also good is a very subjective word. Sometimes. It's just hard to find your match.

  Amy: Yes.

  Melissa: Feels to me sometimes, like I'm. I've been married for 26 years, but the analogy is I'm always dating. I'm always trying to date the next doctor or date, the next yoga teacher or date the next client. And you're still constantly kissing a lot of frogs. Like they're just not for me. And that is just something that I think that we have this idea that I'm going to go to the doctor and it's a doctor, so they're gonna be a- they're gonna be a good doctor. They're gonna be the right doctor for me. And sadly, a lot of times, no.

  Amy: And also Kaitlyn that you had that insight to say, this is not a good fit for me because unfortunately I know, especially like maybe a few generations ahead of us, like the, our parents or grandparents, whatever the doctor said, Is the word of God. They said, don't call them for six months. I'm not gonna call them. They said, take this medication, even though it's making me sick, I'm still gonna take it. cause that's what the doctor said. So that's one of the things about your gen, are you gen Z? I think

  Kaitlyn: I'm a millennial.

  Amy: You're like a, on the young millennial, you're not afraid to say, Hey, wait a minute. This doesn't really make sense or I don't like how this makes me feel. So really Kaitlyn. I just, I wanna speak for Melissa, I just for a moment and just say thank you for being vulnerable for being real with us, for being raw for sharing your story. And it's interesting because people can look at your book and say, wow, she's got it all together and all this stuff but you, which you do today, even though you might not always feel it you're doing it. And one of the things that I tell clients that I work with and not just on a professional level, I tell myself and I tell my friends and whoever will listen is that we have to act as if so we have to act as if you are a best selling author. You have to act as if you are okay. You have to act as if you feel safe. You have to act as if you are confident, because we wanna hardwire that thinking and that takes discipline. It takes practice. And I am really encouraged and inspired to see how you continue to act as if you have these, these dreams that become a reality for you. And sounds like you've got a lot of kindling projects in the making really.

  Kaitlyn: Yes I do. For sure.

  Melissa: How are you balancing that? How are you budgeting your time and your energy for-

  Kaitlyn: so I have a pretty standard schedule. I always start my day writing affirmations about myself on the mirror in the bathroom. That's like literally how I built my confidence and came out of my holes. I just started, even though I hated myself at first, like I just started writing things I didn't even believe at first, every day on that. And then over time I got excited to go write it. I'm like, oh yeah, I'm a badass,

  Melissa: yeah. You are a badass!

  Kaitlyn: And but that actually helped me get my time in order. So My schedule's a little different than like you hear a lot of people say, oh, the earlier you wake up the better. So for me, I believe it depends on your lifestyle. For me and my husband, cause he works second shift, I wanna be able to see him. So I, stay up til two, three in the morning, but then I sleep until eight, nine, 10 in the morning and that's not typical for most people, but for me it works. And so the thing that is, I just, time block, I'm like, okay. So from this time to this time, I have this going on from this time to this time and I'm budgeting it that way. And then I'm also learning to delegate. So I have An amazing VA. That just literally takes things from me. Without even asking is okay, let me take that for you. Okay. Let me take that for you. I don't know where I'd be without Camille. Camille's like my life's neighbor. I tell you

  Melissa: Would you be willing to share with us a little bit about, I know so many people, including Amy and I are waking up to this idea of a VA, but how did you find that person and what was the process like? Is that something you could share?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah. Found 'em through Corey Bayer, they have executive VA and I was a little hesitant at first cause I've had employees that, don't do anything and then I have people that just don't have the right time that I need. And I got introduced to Camille over a cat and I knew right away she just was the sweetest person ever. And she's actually become more of a best friend than like a, you have the stigma that, business owners are like, VAs are over here and they work for me and they do what I say, right? That's not how her and I think this thing is at all, like for her, it's this is what we need to get done today. But how are, how is your dog that was sick? How is this, like you care about them, you show them that you care and then they're willing to care back.

  Melissa: Is she a, is she a direct employee to you or you're paying a service?

  Kaitlyn: She is a direct employee now, but she is in the Philippines. So she is an absolute sweetheart though. I just adore her.

  Melissa: I have this sort of concern too. I know we are living in a global world, but how do you make sure that you're hiring somebody at a fair rate in another country? Did you look into that process too?

  Kaitlyn: So I looked at- I pay her more than most people would pay a VA. Over there most people are like, oh, two, $4 is fair, which it is like 14, $15 over there. But I pay her because I think, for the work that she does for me, one, I wanna make sure she knows, I appreciate it. I'm not gonna just, pay whatever, I just, for me I know what it's like to be the minimum wage worker and to be the person that you know, is thrown crap on and, has to deal with it. And most of the time they do more work than the boss themselves. And so I just- I wanted her to know. I value that. And because of that, she like volunteers her time all the time. She's like always on top of it. Like even when her power was out, she would go like a walk and be like, figuring out how to get on to help me. And I wouldn't ask her to, but she would because I take care of her.

  Amy: Yes you're- yep, you're talking to two bosses. So we get it, you wanna-

  Melissa: That's the important lesson for when you're running a business is taking care of the people who work for you.

  Amy: Absolutely. Absolutely. I That's something that, that I miss, probably one of the things I miss the most about my previous employment I manage to pretty high level departments and my employees. I love to take care of them because. I'm a caretaker by nature, but meeting their needs before they were even asking for 'em and the bottom line too ladies, is that we wanna treat people the way we wanna be treated. So we're gonna be respectful. We're going to honor them. We're going to take care of them. And then, then they have skin in the game because they see, wow, this is someone I care about. This is someone I want to succeed. I hitch my cart on the back of this truck because I wanna keep going. So that's what we're doing here in the kindling project is we hitch our, it's not a truck it's hitch our, whatever on the back end.

  Melissa: Wagon

  Amy: thank you. We're hitching our wagons and Kaitlyn. We are inviting you to be a part of our wagon. And we're, so we're so grateful that you spent time with us today and if nothing else the big takeaway is that you've out, you've overcome and you do demonst. And you do walk the walk of integrity of adversity of challenges and Melissa, and I can tell you that what, what may have kept you sick in your secrets will become part of your superpower, knowing that you have survived attempts on your life, knowing that you have overcome mental health challenges. And they sound like there's some pretty, pretty significant ones as well. And you continue to and your story's not over, and just knowing that you can always ask for help, and we are here for you. We are gonna cheer for you. We would love to collaborate you with you on a different level at some point. And we're gonna be here to help stoke your fire. And however, we can do it. We're gonna be here for you. So I appreciate that. I wish we could get I'm very like what am I nostalgic and melancholy and I love to hug and I wish I could just hug you right now.

  Kaitlyn: I'm the same way so I get it. Virtual hug.

  Amy: Where are you? Are you in Ohio?

  Kaitlyn: Michigan.

  Amy: Wait, you're in Michigan. Where in Michigan if you don't mind me asking?

  Kaitlyn: I am in grand rapids.

  Amy: Oh, okay. Because when you said pine rest, did you say pine? Was it or pine crest?

  Kaitlyn: Yeah. Pine rest. Sorry.

  Amy: Okay. When you said that, I was like, There's a place like that in Michigan. I'll tell you just really quick, my niece will be going to grand valley in next month. So when I come up to see her, I would love to see you and I know Melissa's daughter is potentially interested at the university as well and there's some really great places there. I know our friend Marni Wolf loves grand rapids.

  There's lots of yummy places there. So we're gonna have to come up and give you a hug.

  Kaitlyn: Uh, yeah!

  Melissa: Yeah! We can have coffee, we can have a hug and maybe we can put a project together. Maybe we can do an event together. I feel like this is just the beginning for all three of us.

  Kaitlyn: Agreed. Agreed.

  Amy: Thank you so much, Kaitlyn. Is there anything you wanna leave us with? Is there anything you wanna, any last things you wanna say?

  Kaitlyn: I'm just grateful that I was on today and be able to talk to you. .

  Melissa: Yeah, I'm gonna be saying this all week, my mess is my message. That's my takeaway from you because that's powerful instead of hiding it.

  Kaitlyn: Oh, thank you.

  Melissa: Just owning it, just owning it.

  Kaitlyn: Yeah,

  Amy: Yeah. Yeah. As soon as we own it, man, we can get into this solution a lot faster. So-

  Melissa: Thanks for supporting the kindling project and thanks for being on today and reach out to us anytime. Let us know what we can do.

  Kaitlyn: Absolutely. Thank you ladies so much.

  Amy: Thank you. Keep up the great work.

  Melissa: Have a great day!

  Kaitlyn: You too.

  Melissa: Bye Kaitlyn.