Legacy Matters: Smart Estate Planning for the Future with Karen Schultz-Tarnopol
In this episode of the Kindling Project Podcast, Melissa Halpin engages in a profound conversation with Karen Schultz-Tarnopol about the significance of legacy and estate planning, particularly for women in midlife. They explore the emotional aspects of legacy, the importance of preparing for the future, and how to navigate the complexities of estate planning. Karen shares her insights on empowering women to view legacy planning as an act of love rather than a morbid task, and discusses the challenges of letting go of heirlooms and memories. The conversation also touches on the unique aspects of planning for pets, conflict resolution in estate matters, and the journey of combining personal experiences with professional endeavors in the realm of legacy consulting.
Don't wait! Get started with Karen below:
https://www.heirloomconsultants.com/
Heirloomconsultants@gmail.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/karen-schultz-tarnopol-3b9697250
Listen to the full episode:
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Melissa Halpin (00:10)
Hey friends, welcome back to the Kindling Project Podcast where we talk about purpose, reinvention, and lighting the fire for what's next, especially for Gen X and midlife women. Today we're talking about something that touches all of us, even if we don't always know how to name it, legacy.
what we are leaving behind, and how can we shape it while we're still here. Our guest, Karen Schultz-Tarnopol, is a writer, a mother, a legacy and a state consultant, and the founder of Heirloom Consulting. She helps preserve personal stories, navigate estate planning, and create clarity around what matters most. Welcome, Karen.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (00:28)
Thank
Thank you. So good to see you, Melissa. Thanks for having me.
Melissa Halpin (00:51)
It's good to see you. Thanks for coming.
I think this is an important conversation for so many women that I know, including myself. You know, when I was reading about and talking to you about how you started this business, can see this playing out in so many people's lives, how legacy planning isn't something that we even think about until we're in the middle of it.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (01:11)
That's true. You know, a lot of people learn the hard way because somebody in their family didn't leave their legacy in order and they're having to clean it up and they're white knuckling their way through it and they're realizing, I probably should get my stuff in order. This is taking me 400 hours to undo my parents, you know, state. So, yeah.
Melissa Halpin (01:18)
Mm-hmm.
I
Right. Yeah,
I've seen that with friends and family where the taking care of the estate can take a year, it can take so many resources. And then if they didn't leave clear plans, you know, it causes argument and even court battles. So what is...
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (01:46)
I
worked on a case that took five years and this guy wasn't even a close relative who had to handle it all. It somebody who had to spend all their own personal time working on it and it took five years of his life. I mean, that's a lot.
Melissa Halpin (01:50)
my gosh.
It is a lot. It is a lot. So how do you define legacy really?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (02:07)
Well, I define legacy in so many different ways. know, obviously for me as a mother, my most important legacy is what am I leaving my kids with? Am I leaving them with good values? Am I leaving them with, you know, have I helped a lot of people in my life? Have I made people I meet feel good and feel happy when they left me and loved and cared for? But in my business, of course, it's...
have you prepared your life for when you die? We're all gonna die. I mean, that's my favorite thing. We're all gonna die. Sorry, that's just the facts. So better to be prepared, have it all organized, and then hand over this nice little package to your family so they can unravel it easily. They're not spending a lot of time. They're grieving. They don't want to be bothered with this. And when you ask them to be your trustee or your personal representative,
Melissa Halpin (02:41)
Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (03:01)
you know, in their 30s or 40s, they're like, yeah, sure. I'm the lawyer in the family. I'll do it, no problem. But then they have three kids and a career and all these different things. They don't have time. They don't want to do it. They don't want your heirlooms. They don't want your dishes. don't want, you know, most of the time they don't. Or the alternative, they all fight over one painting or one watch or one, I've seen Bar Mitzvah book, you know, like the craziest.
Melissa Halpin (03:19)
Right.
Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (03:29)
things that people will fight in court over for $100,000 in legal fees. So the more you have it set up and the more prepared you are, obviously it just makes it easier for your family when you go. I mean, they already have to deal with the loss of your death. You know, why leave them with this big pile of mess to sit through and do this big treasure hunt, which personally I love to do, but that's my career. You know, it's not my family, right? So.
Melissa Halpin (03:32)
Right.
Right.
Right.
Right.
So when women come to you, what is it they're looking for?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (04:02)
You know, they just want somebody to guide them, to sometimes do the work for them. I have clients that I'm just navigating them through the process. Have you thought about this? Have you asked your lawyer this? Have you, you know, done this for yourself? You know, different, you know, I kind of coach them through it. Most of them though are like, please just handle this for me. Please, you know.
Melissa Halpin (04:05)
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (04:25)
organize all the different aspects of this estate administration so I don't have to. So I could just go read and live my life and be with my loved ones and you know kind of relax and get through this. So they just kind of hand it all over to me. They just want to know it's taken care of easily, effortlessly and it's not going to cost them a million dollars to get it done because somebody who knows how to do it can get it done more efficiently than they can.
Melissa Halpin (04:52)
Is it a service
that most people can afford?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (04:55)
You know, it's generally paid for by the estate. So if somebody leaves a legacy of assets, you know, money, then the money comes from the person who died, generally speaking. So, yeah, sure.
Melissa Halpin (05:03)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
So are the clients that reach out to you, they're already dealing with the death? Do you also have clients who reach out to you that want to help planning their own estate?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (05:15)
Thank
Yes, yes, we do have legacy planning clients where we meet with them in advance, you know, in their 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s, and we help them keep up with their organization and assets and we write down everything A to Z that you're going to need. In fact, our format is in the format of the, they call the 706 return, which is the estate tax return. So if you end up needing to file a estate tax return.
Melissa Halpin (05:47)
Okay.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (05:49)
We just hand this over to the CPA and they can easily get the job done without spending a ton of money. And it was, you know, it was like that by design because I used to do those types of returns with my state playing lawyer I with. So just try, I designed it just to make everything easier for everybody and save money.
Melissa Halpin (06:12)
So there's like the legal and the technical and the structural aspect of estate planning. But I noticed that your blog is sort of rich with some introspection about loss, about letting go, about parenting. How do the personal experiences and aspects of estate planning guide you in the way you approach this work?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (06:25)
Thank
would say, you know, everything leads to everything, right? I would say the losses that I've had have helped me create and foster compassion for others. You know, I can really see their pain and I can feel their pain. So it helps me to be more delicate with them and sometimes stronger with them when they need it or, you know, just to find that balance because sometimes people need you to hold their hand and sometimes they need you to like get on your back and carry them, you know, just.
Melissa Halpin (06:42)
Yeah.
Right,
right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (07:01)
It just helps you to feel more what they're feeling, to address them in the way they need to be addressed at that time.
Melissa Halpin (07:09)
Yeah, I think from the Killing Project perspective, it's somewhat unusual to say that you have a passion for death or caring for people who are dealing with death. But I can see where we need those kind of souls, people that see it, that feel it, that are empathetic towards it, because every single one of us is going through this ourselves and, of course, with our loved ones.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (07:20)
Yeah.
Yeah, and we're the sandwich generation, right? So we've got our kids, we've got our parents, we're stuck right in the middle right now. And it's a lot for people. So just know somebody's there that can just help them. The simplest thing, know, maybe filling out a form might be a two hour process for somebody who is just not used to it. And I can maybe get it done in 10, 15 minutes. So just easing the burden.
Melissa Halpin (07:38)
Yeah.
Yep. It is a lot. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (08:01)
helping people feel more calm and taken care of.
Melissa Halpin (08:04)
How can women reframe legacy planning as an empowering act rather than a morbid task or something that's scary for them?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (08:05)
you
Yeah, I understand that people are scared talking about it. I really do. I don't share that value because I guess because I talk about it all the time. But it's so empowering setting things up and preparing and having everything done at your will. At your discretion, you know, knowing that your family is going to be taken care of. What's more empowering than that, right? And just knowing that you have done everything you could.
Melissa Halpin (08:16)
Right.
Right.
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (08:40)
to take care of your family even after you're gone. Which is all we do anyways, right?
Melissa Halpin (08:40)
Right.
Right.
Right. Well, yeah. Yeah, and preserve any assets that you may have had, because I've seen those, like you mentioned, of disappear in a lawsuit or in a drug out process.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (08:55)
So many different ways. mean, even in a divorce, for example, after you get divorced, people forget to change their assets. So their ex-husband is still getting their 401k. You know, it's little things like that that people are not paying attention to or reassigning your VA benefits or anything. You know, all these different things matter. And if somebody isn't really going through line by line with you and addressing each and every item like your pets or like your
Melissa Halpin (09:06)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (09:25)
What do want your funeral to be like? Or, you know, all these different things that are just little, or even just your personal property. You might have a favorite thing you want to give to your favorite niece. And, you know, it's not written anywhere. So you don't know what's going to happen when you die. But if you set it up, it's done.
Melissa Halpin (09:29)
Yeah.
Right.
Right. Right. Yeah. I guess I'm at a point, I'm in my early 50s and I still have teenagers, but I have aging parents and these conversations are, I think, really useful. And also what it makes me think about when you're talking is how much not having it resolved might be stressing us out or overwhelming us in the background of our mind.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (10:08)
it weighs
tiny, for sure. Because you know something needs to be done, but maybe you're not quite sure. You know, I should be doing something. I don't know what it is, but it's weighing on me. And I know that if I die tomorrow, my family is going to be like, what? Bless you. Right. I mean, imagine leaving a giant pile of, let's say, garbage for your kids.
Melissa Halpin (10:09)
Yeah.
Right.
Thank you. Sorry. Go ahead. ⁓
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (10:36)
after you leave. You would never do that, right? So why would you do the emotional, the paperwork, all that other stuff? You could just handle it. You know what you want. You know what your plans are. So just put it down in paper and make sure it's all documented and it's easy. And it's just conversation. I think that's the big thing that people don't understand is it's just conversation. It's not, you can change your mind tomorrow if you don't like what you did.
Melissa Halpin (10:39)
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I feel like us Gen X women were the keepers of all the family stuff, right? The photos, the heirlooms, even the unresolved emotional history. It's like, how do you navigate going in there and deciding what to keep, what to let go, what to pass on?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (11:19)
That's a really great question. actually had this conversation with somebody the other day. We were talking about how their wife just holds onto every single thing. And I actually have a client right now who has, I think, seven storage units filled with paper. And every month for 25 years, they've been paying for that storage unit. So I think you have to think of what is the financial cost? What is the emotional cost? The weight that that carries on you? Because when you die,
Melissa Halpin (11:28)
Yeah. Yeah.
my gosh.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (11:47)
somebody has to go through seven storage units to make sure there's nothing important in there. And then you have to pay somebody to clean it out. So I think, you know, especially like the kids drawings, like that's always my favorite. That was the hardest thing for me, the kids drawings and the photos. What do you do with them? But I've moved a lot. And so every time I move, think, do I want to move this again? Like who's going to ever look at this? Right? Took out all the duplicate photos, that kind of thing.
Melissa Halpin (11:47)
Right.
Right.
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (12:15)
But still, I have way too many photos, boxes of photos. Because, you know, in our day we took actual pictures, right? Printed them out. So, yeah, I guess you just have to look at each item and say, you know, is it enriching my life? Will it enrich somebody else's life at some other point? And if not, just get rid of it. Get rid of books first, because they're the heaviest. That's my best advice. Yeah, read it and then donate it.
Melissa Halpin (12:18)
Me too. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Your best advice, books first.
Yeah, that makes sense. We also, our family has moved zigzag across the country a couple times. And it took us at least three or four moves to stop moving around like our college textbooks. when, like there were boxes that had moving stickers from multiple moving companies. There was allied stickers and Mayflower stickers on the same boxes that had just never been open and moved from Michigan to Kansas.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (12:58)
I'm sorry.
Melissa Halpin (13:12)
to California, back to Michigan. And then I just realized, like, this is so expensive, such a waste of time. It's environmentally not a good idea. So, right. And then this last move back to Michigan, we donated tons and tons of books to, the library. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (13:13)
Bye.
Right, right, right, right.
it's good. There's a
lot of places you can donate books. You know, think about it, know, jails, how great would that be? you know, any library or even elderly facilities. There's a lot of places where you can donate books and even probably records and different things. Although records are very in style again, so maybe hold on to those.
Melissa Halpin (13:32)
Yeah.
alone.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I had, I had like tubs. I have tubs and tubs of CDs from my college days. And I can remember when my son was little and he was like asking about, well, what are those? And I'm like, those are CDs. And he just, he couldn't really understand like, how did the music get off of that little plastic thing? Like into your iPod mom. I'm like, it didn't. That's why they're in the tubs.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (13:57)
We'll
you
That's
right. That's why they're going to clog up the environment. Those landfills.
Melissa Halpin (14:19)
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, no one's ever going to
play your college CDs. That's probably a good starter for me.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (14:25)
No.
That is a good end of the VHS. Although there are collectors, believe it or not. So there's somebody out there, maybe on Facebook, that would buy them a Marketplace. Marketplace is the best place to dump all your stuff.
Melissa Halpin (14:34)
There you go.
So do you have a story or a moment from this kind of work where you help someone understand an heirloom or an artifact that really changed their perspective or changed how you look at this work?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (14:49)
Gosh, I would love to say every single client sorta has an aha moment. Yeah, I guess just, gosh, I don't know. I can't really pick one, let think.
Melissa Halpin (14:54)
Yeah.
Mm-mm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (15:02)
Yeah, I don't know. Nothing's coming to mind in that way.
Melissa Halpin (15:06)
Yeah. Yeah, I just imagine
that there are a lot of aha moments because, yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (15:13)
wait, I do have one. I'm sorry. I'm
almost clearing one in my life right now. Sorry. I just totally spaced out for a minute. so we're working on an estate right now that we're liquidating. It was over 2000 square foot house, full barn and six car garage and attic filled with collectible stuff. So this gentleman had collected sports memorabilia and police badges and patches and like all this crazy stuff. We moved it to our warehouse and we have been selling it.
Melissa Halpin (15:37)
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (15:42)
It's been six months. We've sold the heck out of it. We still have a ton left. And every person that comes in is a collector. And every person who comes in sees how much he has. And they all say, my, that's going to be me one day. And so it's really been an eye-opener for people we're meeting who are collectors who are like, OK, maybe I need to slow down on this collecting or sell off some of it and maybe preserve some of it. And my kids don't really want it.
Melissa Halpin (15:59)
Right.
Yeah.
Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (16:11)
So I
always say to them, do you have a wife? And they say yes. And they say, here's my friend. She's going to need us.
Melissa Halpin (16:16)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah,
Yeah, exactly. Well, maybe one tip could be to identify, is there a museum or another collection that your collection can add to somewhere? Because, yeah, I don't think your kids want it. No.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (16:33)
No, kids almost never want your stuff. Even
the good collectible stuff, if they don't have a passion for it, they're not going to want it and they're going to sell it for 10 cents and you're going to be in your grave growing because you wish they knew how much they were giving away.
Melissa Halpin (16:41)
Right.
⁓
Yeah,
I can see that. I can see that.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (16:54)
There's a lot of collectors out there. You'd be shocked. A lot of people.
Melissa Halpin (16:57)
So
are there other services besides legacy consulting that, I don't know if it's trusteeship or student coordination or what to do with your pets, are there kinds of misunderstood or overlooked planning services that you want to share?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (17:16)
You know, so I worked as a state planning paralegal for 15 years doing trust administration and I also worked in real estate both residential and commercial. And so when I looked at all that, I really realized the gap that was in those two industries together. And the gap is whoever's the trustee and the person who represented it are not really taken care of. They're sort of thrown to the...
Melissa Halpin (17:21)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (17:40)
Throw them to the wind. Good luck. know, call us if you need anything. You know, the attorney's rates are $400, $500 an hour. They don't have the time. They really don't want to do the trust administration work. So it's sort of, like I said, white knuckling their way through it. And it gets extended, extended too long because as a person who just doesn't speak the language and they don't know the questions to ask that kind of thing. So we've created heirloom because it's sort of the A to Z.
Melissa Halpin (17:44)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (18:08)
of everything a state administration. So it might be that we're going to maintain the house because if you don't maintain the house, it becomes dilapidated, which actually happened in a case I worked on. Beautiful house on the lake, beautiful house in Franklin, which you know is a beautiful area on acreage, both dilapidated and they had to tear them down. Now they could have preserved those houses, but they didn't. So they lost out on millions and millions of dollars from this estate.
Or we would sell the house for you. We would do the estate sale, clean out. We find heirs. We find assets. We help work on probate cases that some lawyers do. You know, just anything from A to Z, fill out forms, get through the red tape, help find things that are missing.
Melissa Halpin (18:41)
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (18:58)
You know, we just do A to Z, whatever a person needs. And it's different with every single client, so it's hard to really quantify it. I'm really kind of surprised by the clients that have come our way. We also help with trust funding. So when somebody gets a trust, their lawyer says to them, okay, you signed your document. Now here, go put your assets in the trust. So there's like this bucket and all your assets are in your name and you need to move them to the trust bucket. You know, simplify. Well, people don't do it.
Melissa Halpin (19:03)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (19:27)
they forget. So then
Melissa Halpin (19:27)
Yeah. wait.
When you're saying this, I just realized, like, when we set up our family trust, there was probably some things that we haven't moved in. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (19:37)
Right. And it's, it's
just as simple like, oh, I forgot, but then it becomes a probate item. So then now we need a probate.
Melissa Halpin (19:40)
Yeah.
Yeah, because you're at the attorney's office
and you're like, wait, we have that little life insurance policy from that other job or something that's out there. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (19:51)
Yeah, yeah. Right, so we
help people with that to make sure they do all their trust funding and you know, just everything from A to Z that the lawyer doesn't want to do. I mean, actually our best referral source is from smaller law firms that, you know, they just don't have the capacity. They don't have the team to do all that stuff. They don't have the connections with the real estate companies. know, everything. So.
Melissa Halpin (20:01)
Yeah.
bandwidth, right?
So.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (20:18)
It's really fulfilling and my sons work with me with that.
Melissa Halpin (20:19)
One thing that
I came across that I found kind of interesting, maybe you want to talk about is what happens to your pets when you pass? I think that a lot of people are worried about that.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (20:27)
Oh yeah. Well, I think they
are and they don't plan for it. It's shocking. So the idea of the Pet Trust is that you just plan for the pet like you would plan for your kids. It can be a separate document or it could be part of your trust and your lawyer can help you set it up. But you basically decide, you know, how much money do I want to put into this Pet Trust? So you're prepaying sort of.
Melissa Halpin (20:41)
Mm.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (20:54)
assigning money that you have to take care of your pet when you die because one of you is going to die first, either him or the dog or the cat or whatever, or you. So you have to sort of plan for both possibilities. You decide who your caregiver is going to be. You decide who's your pet trustee is going to be. So your caregiver will take care of the pet, but then somebody needs to oversee the caregiver and pay the caregiver for all the services, the vet bills, the different things.
Melissa Halpin (20:58)
Mm-hmm.
I know.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (21:23)
And they really shouldn't be the same person because that's a conflict, right? And so you decide, you know, how many times you want the dog groomed, what kind of food, what kind of daycare, you know, all the different things. And it's really a very simple thing to make sure your pet's taken care of because if you don't, what happens? It's a mystery. Maybe your family will take the pet.
Melissa Halpin (21:26)
Mm-hmm.
Right.
Yeah, exactly. You see that all the time. a pet
is looking for a home and it's 18 years old, but it lost its owner. That's saddest. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (21:49)
Right, right. Happens every day. Right. And you know, maybe
your family will take your pet, but probably not. Do you want to take your family's pets and aren't yours? That's kind of a burden. So, Pet Trust.
Melissa Halpin (21:55)
Yeah.
Right, right, right.
So another
aspect of this that I bet you come across a lot is conflict and conflict resolution. Can you tell us how you might be able to help with that in certain families?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (22:08)
Yeah, there's a lot of psychology.
You know, I like to think I was a psychologist in a prior life. You know, people just feel like, yes, really comfortable sharing their stuff with me. you know, most of the time you can just help them resolve things easily, but sometimes, you know, it's out of your hands. So then you go to your resources and you figure out who can help this person best. ⁓
Melissa Halpin (22:16)
Okay.
right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (22:33)
But yeah, there's a lot of talking and a lot of consoling and a lot of hand holding that goes on. But you know, I always say to people, there's not one asset in the world that's worth losing a family member over. And that's true of divorce, loss. And it's shocking how people get so crazy after death about money. Or even before death, like when their parents get older, they suddenly decide they need the money before their parent even dies. I see that a lot.
Melissa Halpin (22:53)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (23:00)
and
they cause conflicts. It's crazy.
Melissa Halpin (23:02)
Yeah,
I've seen some of that too.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (23:05)
Yeah, happens.
Melissa Halpin (23:07)
Speaking of money, do you think that I imagine some women feel like they're not
wealthy enough for estate planning? How do you address that?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (23:15)
I understand that. They feel like, I don't have enough assets. I don't need an estate plan. I don't need a legacy plan. I mean, at the very, very least, you need a legacy plan because there's somebody you're leaving behind and there's definitely assets and personal property. And you maybe want a certain outcome at your funeral and maybe, you know, maybe you don't want a funeral. Maybe you want to donate your body to science or something like that.
Melissa Halpin (23:41)
Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (23:43)
You know, the only way to express that is to plan. You know, it's not just about the money, it's about what you're leaving behind. You could write letters to people and tell them how much you love them. And there's a million things you can do. You could do scrapbooks, you could create a book that has all your favorite memories and you can shudder fly or somebody does that. But there's a bunch of companies out there that do that kind of thing. But there's all kinds of different things. Do I see a lot of that?
Melissa Halpin (23:47)
Mm-hmm.
I will.
Yeah. Do you see a lot of that? Do
you see a lot of that sort of memory making or memory keeping passing on something in that way?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (24:10)
Yeah.
No,
I don't. I don't. But I think people should. Because wouldn't you love that? I would love to know what my dad was thinking when he died. You know, who he was, more about him. I would love that. He died when I was 10. And I would just love to know who he was. But nobody can convey that to me. If I had a video or something that sort of showed pictures of me and him, you know, back in the day, they didn't take many pictures, probably five pictures of me.
Melissa Halpin (24:20)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (24:43)
My kids, have 10,000 pictures, right? So, you know, I think it's just nice to have that preservation of who the person was. And I think video is a great way to do that. Because you hear them, you see them, you see their mannerisms, you see in their eyes, get a feel for who they are.
Melissa Halpin (24:45)
Right.
Yeah.
I wish
I had that from my grandma. think about like at the end of her life, we were starting to get iPhones and smartphones, but I don't think there's a video of her. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (25:09)
Yeah.
voicemail. Think about that. Like, I have a voicemail from a friend who just died suddenly, and I don't want to erase the voicemail, because I just want to remember him, you know?
Melissa Halpin (25:19)
Mm-hmm.
Right?
Yeah. Yeah. That makes perfect sense. is there like a checklist or something that you share or provide with the clients to go through these things to see like, are these things I want to do or not do?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (25:36)
I have a 16 page document that I created. Yeah, I tried to think of everything possible. So every page doesn't apply to every person. Not everybody has grandkids, that's a whole page, right? Not everybody has boats and RVs. Not everybody has, you know, even children or 401Ks or whatever. But I just tried to think of every possible thing I've come across in my career.
Melissa Halpin (25:39)
my gosh, not a checklist to hold document.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (26:02)
that might
come up. What kind of businesses did you have? Do you have a plan for closing out your business? Is your business appraised? Do we need to get it appraised? Do you have any collectibles? Collectibles are such a big thing. They're so on my mind right now. All different kinds of things that you might forget about. Benefits you had from an old job. We find assets from people who are like, oh my God, I didn't even know. I found unclaimed property.
for a woman 36 different entries from her mother. 36, they never administered her trust and it all went to this state. So all these little things you just might not think about and there's just money sitting there that could maybe help this lady. She's 85 now, but she probably could have really used the money. But, didn't get it.
Melissa Halpin (26:31)
Wow.
Ugh.
Mm-hmm.
Those are good tips.
You seem like a very thorough person and also maybe a writer by, you know, in spirit. I know you have a personal blog as well as a blog on your business page. And so just tell me a little bit about that, like yourself in terms of being a writer and combining your business life with your personal life.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (27:03)
Thank
You know, I never studied in all my college educations, I never studied communications or writing or anything like that. Never even entered my mind. So I really accidentally became a writer to be honest with you. I, when I lost my job in 2008 at Washington Mutual was a big bank. I was a wholesale account rep and the bank closed, you know, with the financial crisis.
Melissa Halpin (27:20)
Yeah.
Okay.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (27:37)
And
I was just scrambling, trying to find something to do with my life. And so I don't, I guess I started writing a blog about what was going on with me. had to get on Medicaid, food stamps. It was terrible. But it was really an eye opener about like what's really going on in the world. And then I wrote for the Jewish news and I just was like, wow, I really love this. I love meeting people. I love learning about people.
Melissa Halpin (27:41)
Right.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (28:04)
And then you're just writing a story about what you learned about them. So then I just started writing more and more and more. And now it is just like the thing that nurtures me. It's the thing that I feel most connected with and most in touch with myself and spirit. And I don't know, I just love it. But it was purely by accident. You know, writing it, you got to write everything. You know what I mean? I'm a litster, I'm always writing, crossing, crossing.
Melissa Halpin (28:04)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. No, I love that. I mean, so much of our conversations with women here is, where does that sort of creative and spiritual core of yourself overlap with what you're doing for a career or for a hobby or for starting a business? And it does seem like you've been able to meld that with the estate planning and the blogging and the storytelling and.
And guess legacy is a form of storytelling after you're gone.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (29:00)
Yeah. You
know, it's so interesting when I look back at my life, much of my life, people have said, you're such a quitter, you're always quitting things. And then I saw this thing on Oprah with Elizabeth Gilbert, and it's something about the hummingbird, the legacy of the hummingbird or something like that. And she was talking about some people are born with a purpose. She was born a writer. She knew she was a writer her whole life. She had a purpose. And I was always like,
Melissa Halpin (29:04)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (29:28)
I just find something and get into it 100%. I dig in, I get into it, then I'm done. I'm onto the next. And so that translated to people that I was a quitter. But how she explains it is that some people are just hummingbirds and they're like connecting people and interesting things and learning here and learning there and, you know, kind of connecting it up. So when I look at my life from that perspective and I look at, you know, the
Melissa Halpin (29:44)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (29:54)
Jagged path that my life was and all the crazy weird things that happened. It makes so much sense that I'm here today Doing exactly what I'm doing today. So I mean I worked for a lot of different people made a lot of people money Was sick to my stomach going to work every day didn't feel good about it at all but made a lot of money and Sort of was the slave to the man so to speak. I decent people don't get me wrong, but you know
Melissa Halpin (30:05)
Right.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (30:23)
you're not doing your, you're not doing what turned out at end of the day. And so when my last boss laid me off, he didn't lay me off, cut my hand half, which is essentially being laid off. Um, I just looked in the mirror and I said, okay, enough. You know how to make other people money. You can certainly make yourself and your family money and take care of yourself. And so we started our own business and it's been great. I wake up every morning just
Melissa Halpin (30:24)
Right.
Mm-hmm.
Enough.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (30:54)
not sick to my stomach, which the not is so important, right? I just get up and I do whatever I wanna do when I wanna do it. Sometimes I work till midnight, but I don't care because I'm doing it, because I want it. I never even think about the money. I never even think about it. I just do the thing. I help the person and make the difference in a person's life. And it just feels so different, but it was scary, you know.
Melissa Halpin (30:58)
Mm-hmm.
Right. But it doesn't even feel like work when it's more of a passion or calling.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (31:22)
I didn't have money for six months, but it's so worth it.
Melissa Halpin (31:27)
Yeah. And you are doing your business with your kids? Did I read that?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (31:32)
Yeah,
my two sons, they're 24 and 26, Jake and Jonah. And, you know, they both had just graduated from college and were like, what should we do? What should we do? And one son did a gap year in Israel and, you know, like just different things. I guess I wouldn't call it a gap year. He just went to Israel and did a program. And my other son was just getting close to graduating. And I was like, you know what, just come work with me. We're starting to get really busy and we got this giant project and it just sort of.
fell into all of our laps to be honest with you. And it was so overwhelming that, you know, we were like sink or swim, let's go. But it worked out really nicely and I love working with them most days. We are a family, you know.
Melissa Halpin (32:07)
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
think a lot of people dream about having a family business and keeping their kids close. I have a design agency. And so far, my kids are 16 and 20. They don't have any interest in it at all. But we'll see. They might change their minds. Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (32:26)
Yeah, they might change their minds. My both of
my kids have said not in a million years what I've dreamed of doing this. And you know, it might not be their passion, but it's something where they can learn a lot quickly. They're, you know, diving head in. Whereas if they went for a company job, you know, I always say proctor and gamble just gives you easy kind of reference. Maybe getting coffee and, you know, doing little tasks and learning a little bit.
Melissa Halpin (32:41)
Right.
Takes a long
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (32:56)
and right
Melissa Halpin (32:56)
time to climb the ladder, yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (32:59)
to really get heavy responsibility and ultimately our family is very entrepreneurial so they'll end up being like that anyways probably so I figure why not learn from mom right?
Melissa Halpin (33:02)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Do you have any tips for people for hiring their kids, working with their kids?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (33:16)
yeah, have separate offices. Yeah. Very defined goals. Yeah. The hardest part is that your mom too, right? So the personal, it's very easy for the personal to come into the professional. So like we'll bicker with each other, different kinds of things like that. so I always say to them, you know, leave our personal life at the door. When we come in and spot a customer, that's it. So.
Melissa Halpin (33:18)
Yeah. That sounds like a, that sounds like a good start. Yeah.
in
Mm-hmm.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (33:43)
You you gotta grow to that point though. We can start off that way.
Melissa Halpin (33:47)
How do you keep your passion and your fire going? Do you have any tips for that?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (33:48)
you
Yeah, I would say I try to follow my intuition in that if I'm feeling down or tired, I close it down. You know what I mean? But when I'm feeling good, I'll work till midnight. So I really try to follow the flow of my energy to, you know, and I only take on stuff that I know is going to make me happy. So if I meet a client and I feel like, oh, I'm not feeling great about this.
Melissa Halpin (34:01)
Mm-hmm.
Mm.
Yeah, that's great advice.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (34:22)
I don't have any problems saying no, I'm not attached to the money anymore, which was really such a big problem for me before, just being attached to the paycheck and oh my gosh, what am going to do? So I guess just following intuition is the key.
Melissa Halpin (34:36)
Yeah, that's the best advice.
So where can our listeners find your writing and learn more about heirloom consulting or learn more about legacy planning?
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (34:40)
You're welcome.
heirloomconsultants.com is the website. And I got to be honest, I don't know what my blog email address or website address is offhand. My writing is really, really honest, I would say. And I share a lot of personal stuff, but
Melissa Halpin (34:49)
Mm-hmm. Okay.
Yeah.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (35:07)
I feel really good about it because it really comes from my heart. Kind of some of it's kind of funny. I try to put a funny spin on things, just not to be so serious about everything. It's worth the read.
Melissa Halpin (35:17)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. I think it's nice to get that inside look at another entrepreneur, the personal and the professional, and how you're balancing those. I think it's clear that, like you said, your story kind of all wove together to put you here, which is, think, a lot of people want affirmation. They want somebody to confirm that even if you have a nonlinear life or you're a nonlinear thinker or you've bounced around a bit, it is all.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (35:47)
Yeah.
Melissa Halpin (35:50)
All the answers are there. And I feel like you told that story on your blog. So I encourage everybody to find Karen on her professional and personal site. And thank you so much for this conversation. You've given us a lot to think about, what we carry, what we pass on, how to deal with our legacy.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (35:51)
Yeah.
Thank you. Bye.
thought in my head. Well, one of the legacy things we also carry on is, you know, stuff that we hold inside of us. We've working a lot on that lately. I have this really great, the gravy lady that helps me sort of release a lot of, you know, the internal stuff that we carry with us because we can pass that on too. a thought. Yeah.
Melissa Halpin (36:31)
That's a nice way to end this. Well, thanks, Karen.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (36:34)
Thank you Melissa. you. Alright,
Melissa Halpin (36:35)
I enjoyed talking to you.
Karen Schultz-Tarnopol (36:38)
take care.
